Identify a 1929 (circa) Riley

[Ray Battersby]

Here’s something Riley enthusiasts might know about.

I believe that the attached photo (also above), may have been taken in Ashton Street, Fleetwood, Lancashire around 1929. It was given to me in the1980s by my late mother. As she handed it over she named the family members inside the car and identified the car as a Riley. She also recalled a comment made by her Uncle Whitley, the car's bowler-hatted owner and driver who lived with his family in Halifax. He was disappointed by his car's performance: "It's supposed to be seven horses but I think half of them are dead!" In the strong Halifax (Yorkshire) accent of the day, this came across as, "It’s supposed to be seven hosses but I think haff on 'em are dee-ad!"

To drive this car from Halifax to Fleetwood, loaded up with five adults and a baby, involved crossing the Pennines on the poor roads of the day. This must have been quite a trek under such a heavy load. No wonder the driver felt the need for more power!

From Uncle Whitley's comment, it's easy to assume that the engine developed seven horsepower but my mother may have recalled his comment incorrectly. To my untutored eyes, the car looks very large to be powered by such a small engine. I have unsuccessfully searched the internet to identify this car model using the distinctive shape of its dog-legged windscreen uprights and the lack of door handles as a clue. Could it also have had three rows of seats or is that an illusion? Do you have any ideas about the car?

[canuck]

Hello Ray
Welcome to the club and forum.

That looks a jolly lot in that car, and making the trek you describe quite a hardy bunch.  

I think your dear Mom was incorrect or her bowler hat sporting Uncle Whitley was pulling her leg.  Uncle Whitley comes across as quite a character  and I think I would have enjoyed meeting him. 

I believe the car in the photo is a 192 ?'s  Bullnose Morris Cowley, reported to have a whopping 27HP output. Click on the photo below for an enlarged view.



I know little of these early cars though for those that were able to have them were allowed a freedom of movement unthought of post WW1 war. 

For sure, for some these times were 'la belle epoque' 


Keep well

Bruce

[Ray Battersby]

Bruce,

Wow! I do believe you are correct. Well done. The dead-straight waist-line and the slightly overhung front screen match perfectly as does the hood frame and the curved boat-tail on the rear quarter.

My mother always appeared so certain that it was a Riley but I now think she was simply getting confused. Perhaps Uncle Whitley once owned a Riley and she was assuming her photo of him in his car meant it was his 7HP Riley!

It's not as though she didn't have an interest in vehicles having passed her driving test in 1936 when she was 18 years old. In fact she gained what today would be a much coveted 'ALL GROUPS' Driving Licence including approval for her to drive what we called in my childhood days a 'Queen Mary'. As you may know, this was a long articulated truck often used by the RAF to recover crashed aircraft to their workshops. Her father had been a driver since before World War One. In the 1920s he became a Fleetwood tram driver (I have his enamel Driver's Badge). He always had cars which my mother often drove when I was a child. These included a pre-war Series E Morris (BCB 122), an early post-war Austin 8 (or was it an Austin 10?) and a late 1950s Morris Minor. Alas, not a single Riley.

Although I am a vintage motorcycle fan I have still read about cars all my life and dimly recollect that a car's nominal engine power was derived from its engine displacement. Hence, an Austin 7's 'output' was derived from its 700cc engine. This was due to the RAC who come up with the over-simplistic formula that an engine developed 1 HP for each 100cc of its engine capacity. This classification was used by manufacturers in their catalogues and by the Department of Transport to determine the road tax that should be paid. Does this mean that the 27HP Morris Bullnose Cowley had a 2,700cc engine?

Of course I could be completely wrong if my own memory has become as deficient as my mothers!

Ray

[canuck]

Hello Ray
As I mentioned I know little about these early cars. I would like to meet someone with a functioning time machine to allow me to travel back to find out first hand. 

So I suspect the HP rating is as you describe and 'odd' for me to comprehend.  The tax man was involved so of course it is 'odd'. 

www.austin7.org/Other%20Articles/RAC%20HP%20Rating/

Todays HP ratings could be rated as 'net' or gross' or at the flywheel or at the road wheels. 

Two evenings ago I had a chat over some 'ales' with a car buddy.  He recalls, (take it or leave it) that this Morris Bullnose was a mega popular model in the day. It had a 1.5 litre side valve power unit rated 12 - 15HP.  So; I suppose the RAC had it right with the 1.5 litre power unit producing 15HP? 

Ah the goold old days

Keep well
Bruce